For the June 2025 episode of the International Gender Champions podcast, we are joined by Nathalie Chuard, Director of the Geneva Centre for Security Sector Governance (DCAF). She shares why, in its 25th anniversary year, the WPS Agenda is more relevant than ever - highlighting how current global trends - such as increasing militarisation, overlapping crises, and ongoing gender inequality -continue to shape the experiences of women in conflict settings, as well as their roles in peacebuilding, justice, and community resilience.
TRANSCRIPT
Hannah Reinl
Hello and welcome to a new episode of the IGC podcast. My name is Hannah Reinl, and I’m with the International Gender Champions Secretariat in Geneva.
Today, we will discuss the Women, Peace and Security - in short WPS – agenda, and what it takes to bring it to life. And for that, I am joined by one of our Geneva-based Champions : Nathalie Chuard, Director of the Geneva Centre for Security Sector Governance.
Nathalie Chuard started her career in 2000 at the Swiss NGO Terre des hommes and took on a variety of postings abroad, including in Afghanistan, Indonesia, Iran, Russia, Madagascar, and the Middle East. She joined the Swiss Federal Department of Foreign Affairs in 2005 and, as a Swiss Diplomat, served among other positions as Deputy Head of the Human Rights Section in Berne and as Political Coordinator at the Mission of Switzerland to the UN in New York. From 2018, she headed the Middle East and Northern Africa Division (Humanitarian Aid) of the Swiss Agency for Development and Cooperation. From 2020 to 2023, she was the Ambassador of Switzerland to Bangladesh. Joining DCAF in March 2023, Ambassador Nathalie Chuard is the first woman appointed as Director of the organisation.
It's a pleasure to have you with us today, Nathalie- welcome to the IGC Podcast.
Nathalie Chuard
Hi Hannah, it’s a real pleasure to be with you as well today, and with all people listening.
Hannah Reinl
So let's dive in. This year, we actually mark 25 years since the adoption of UN Security Council Resolution 1325 on Women, Peace and Security. Tell us, Nathalie, why is the WPS agenda more relevant today than ever?
Nathalie Chuard
I think that in all wars, and I mean today as has always been the case women are disproportionately affected. Women also typically continue to bear the brunt of crises that are multiple and intersecting, like conflict, but also climate change, displacement and violence. And at the same time, women are often leading the responses. They are rebuilding communities and peace, they are standing up for justice. And we know that when women are involved in peace processes, when they really have a seat around the table -and here we speak about not having a token representation-agreements are more likely to last. And this is therefore even more disappointing that there are not more women negotiators who are involved in peace talks.
So at the time of this rising militarisation that we see happening everywhere and this increased fragility, we have to recognise the role of the women and the role that they have in building and contributing to peace. And this role is more important than ever.
So their inclusion in prevention, peace building and peacekeeping leads to more democratic governance, economic recovery and reduced violence. And all that is well documented and we see it in many, many contexts. So, this is why I am a bit concerned or very concerned that the attacks on the gender equality agenda can really bring us back and jeopardize the important progress that has been made over the last years. And bringing us back will not only negatively impact the women. This will also affect the community as a whole. So for us, for DCAF, for our community, the message is clear: as individuals, as countries, we should recommit to the implementation of the Women, Peace and Security Agenda. And we need to do that to fulfil the women’s human rights and also to create these more equal societies. And this is for the benefit of everyone.
Hannah Reinl
There's definitely a lot of reason for concern these days, which is ironic as we're celebrating the 25th anniversary and the quarter century of WPS this year. How, in your view, has the WPS Agenda influenced security sector governance over the past 25 years? What are some successes that come to your mind that we could potentially also build on in our communications around WPS. And where do you see remaining gaps or potentially gaps that are now opening again that we urgently need to address?
Nathalie Chuard
Yeah, I think that's really where we are today, right, with an agenda that has been really moving ahead for a long time and with new challenges or additional challenges. But I think at DCAF we really work with security institutions to tackle the structural barriers to women’s full participation. And we do believe and once again that's something that is proven, that the security sector, so the police, the army, that represent the society in which it operates is not only more efficient, it is also more legitimate.
So in this regard, really, WPS is crucial and the resolution 1325 has really brought a gender lens to our sector, which also has remained traditionally male dominated. So since 2000 we have moved from policy to concrete action. And there have been major efforts at country level with the national action plans to integrate gender perspectives. And this has really made possible to recruit, to train, to promote women in the police, in the military and also in the peacekeeping forces. And this has really been transformative because we have seen the participation of women that has increased in peacekeeping, policing and military and also in intelligence services. And that has happened in many countries.
However, as we always say, it's not about numbers only. It's really about the meaningful participation in the decision making and in the leadership roles. And I wanted here to take the example of Togo. In the armed forces of Togo, the first cohort of women entered in 1996 as medical personnel, and today the hold senior roles like Head of Armed Forces, Family Medical Center and Deputy Director of health services. So, the environment has changed, but that has also changed in the tone and the atmospheres with Togo senior military officials now speaking out against abuse. And there are also more open conversation with families, communities to challenge the norms barring women from the military service.
And here I really want to say role models are very important and we've seen that numerous times. That really proves that change is possible. And we hear that in particular from the women that are serving. And they say when girls see us, they think it's possible for them to do it, too. And really, that's fundamental.
But what I personally find extremely important is that the integration of women in the security sector really contributes to the improvement of the relationship with the people that they serve and indeed, inclusive security sectors are more responsive to community needs, they are more trusted by the public and this is really important today, especially at a time when we have this huge trust gap.
So in general we have made progress but things are still moving too slow. So we have moved ahead, shifting from a state-centric militarised concept of security to more human security. But now we see this risk of going backwards with the return, this really important return, of hard security in the current perception of the world. So at any rate, there are also in many places, I would say even almost everywhere, still persistent cultural bias and stereotypes. Concretely, many security institutions still lack full gender integration in doctrine, training and operation, and also work-life balance and family support structure still pose a major challenge for women on deployment or in demanding roles.
So also very importantly, supporting the Women, Peace and Security Agenda and the inclusion of women in the security sector requires a sustained support from the top, from the leadership. And this is not easy at a time of competing priorities where gender consideration can become or remain secondary, rather than central to the efforts or to the reforms that need to take place. So, yes, Hannah, we are on our way, but we are not there yet. That's pretty clear.
Hannah Reinl
That's for sure, but I believe what you said really closes the loop on what you said at the beginning: that we need to move beyond tokenistic representation and really address the structural barriers that women face in these spaces, right?
Nathalie Chuard
Absolutely. And I think until we tackle this kind of root causes, I would say we won't be able to do progress in a significant way.
Hannah Reinl
Absolutely. You've already alluded to some of it, but I'm curious to hear more. How do you work towards integrating the WPS agenda concretely at DCAF, across your organisational and your programmatic work?
Nathalie Chuard
I'm very proud of that and really, at DCAF, we integrate gender in a systematic way, across all our programmes. And now we apply the OECD markers to ensure transparency and accountability in how gender commitments translate into actual resources. We have also started the e-learning flagship course, “integrating gender in project design”, and I encourage everyone to look at our website, this is available for really anyone.
We are also continuing to support our partners on their journeys because these are journeys and I think as a starting point, knowing where you stand is really crucial and for instance, last week DCAF was with our partner, the Ministry of Defence of North Macedonia, to mark the successful completion of the gender self-assessment. And this process is a strategic step forward in strengthening gender-responsive institutional culture, revealing important gaps and important opportunities to progress while also setting a positive example for security institutions.
And I have another example from The Gambia where DCAF is active since 2017 with the Gambia police forces, and we supported them and the immigration department in making their institution more effective and accountable. And one of the key achievements that we have observed is that we have been able to help developing this first ever police doctrine, which is now part of the official training curriculum. So really the sustainability of also the support that we are given when our partners are taking those things on board. And this doctrine integrates gender mainstreaming, it embeds Women, Peace and Security principles into the doctrine, the leadership development and all the manuals. So that's really a nice success. But I mean that means also that internally we had to adjust and strengthen also the way to approach all that and we have set an internal gender focal point network with colleagues from all across DCAF that are supporting innovative approaches and also encouraging peer learning in gender and security sector governance.
And finally, I would like to say that I am a proud International Gender Champion and I'm happy to support, not only the network, but also support my amazing colleagues that are working in this field and all across DCAF to showcase their work. And I really feel that it is my responsibility to continue engaging and investing to make a difference.
Hannah Reinl
Congratulations on these impressive achievements. We know that gender mainstreaming is a long journey, but it's been really great to see DCAF trailblazing it, particularly in the space of security sector governance. So unfortunately, we're getting close to the end of this podcast, but I'd like to ask you a final question that's a bit more forward-looking. So with view to the next five years, what do you believe are some concrete steps that must be taken to ensure that WPS doesn't slip off the radar and remains a priority in global security governance?
Nathalie Chuard
I think that the first step is to ensure and really to stand up so that Women, Peace and Security remains a priority. Full stop. So this will not be easy. But at DCAF, we are really committed to play our part.
I think that when it comes to security sector governance, we must move beyond symbolic inclusion as you said earlier towards this meaningful participation of women in peace and security decision making. In general, I would say there are many needs or things that we have to do, to support, in order to get there, but one of the things is really to remain coherent at the programmatic level. So that means that we need to systematically apply a gender perspective across all stages of peace processes, security sector reform and conflict prevention. As importantly, I would say there are three things that are key for me: It's a political leadership, it’s accountability and it's also engagement of the civil society. Political leadership, we spoke about it earlier, is really crucial. It sets the agenda, it drives the reforms. It's also the allocation of the necessary resources. And accountability ensures implementation, it measures progress. And finally, the civil society engagement is key because it grounds the agenda in real needs and perspectives. So all that is not to be missed. I think it is essential to all societies where really everyone can live in peace and security.
Hannah Reinl
Standing up, standing firm with leadership, accountability and civil society engagement, that's the things that we're gonna take away for today. Natalie, thank you so much for joining this podcast and for sharing how safety and Inclusion go hand in hand when it comes to our collective future.
Nathalie Chuard
Thank you, Hannah, it’s been really a pleasure to be with you today.